Oxidisation

[Fiona]

Right, after so many people commenting on my shite paintwork last night I thought it was time to seek professional advice.

Here's the problem:

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff144/flossie007/PICT0513.jpg

The body is fibreglass, not painted, the colours in the gel coat. A few years ago some complete t**t splattered my car with cutting compound while working on a boat. I sponged it off with water as gently as I could but it had dried on.
No apparent damage at the time so I couldn't prove he was the cause but within weeks the gel coat started oxidising, giving the crappy hazy appearance you see here.

It polishes out with T-cut, autoglym paint renovator etc but it doesn't matter how many coats of wax I give it, within a few weeks it always comes back. The problem with that, apart from not having the elbow grease to keep perservering with it, is that the Gel coat is starting to get thin in places from excessive T-cutting!

I need a permanent solution. A couple of people(Chris C and stu- thanks) have suggested cutting it back and laquering. That seems to be the most cost effective way to go. Just wondered if anyone had any experience of this or any suggestions before I spend my hard earned?
Competitive quotes also welcome :)

Don't really want to paint the car, as the colour is in the gel and I've seen how paint can craze on fibreglass.

Cheers, Fiona xx

[NWVT]

the cutting back and then laquering is certainly one way to go but as you say it is thin in places the new water based paints are a lot better for fibre glass and really shouldnt crack especially if they use the right laquer and hardning agent.

[Lakelord]

I realise you've already stated 'waxing' after you've polished the car but have you tried using a glaze after polishing? There's a number of them on the market, the Autoglym one is known as Extra Gloss Protection (EGP). It should be applied after polishing with their Super Resin Polish (SRP) and left to cure for at least three hours - longer if you can, before buffing off.
The EGP bonds to the paint work and should give a very hard, clear coat that will last three to six months as long as you don't use harsh ( or Bachi ;o) ) detergents when washing.
Make sure you use the SRP as opposed to their Ultra Deep Shine Polish though as the solvents in the EGP don't work with the ultra deep shine polish.
Failing that, as others have suggested, lacquering may be your only option.
Finally, I wouldn't recommend using T-Cut, Paint Restorer etc as they are very agressive and will only strip another layer of the gel coat away. You'd be better to use the SRP and plenty of elbow grease.

[Fiona]

That was always my favourite combo before the problems started Autoglym Super Resin Polish followed by Extra Gloss Protection would bring it up lovely. But sadly not anymore. SRP won't touch the oxidisation(or maybe I just don't have the elbow grease) the only way of getting rid of it is the dreaded T-cut and as you say thats a bit Harsh.
I also found the oxidisation came back after polishing with Autoglym but I never tried leaving the EGP on for 3 hours before buffing off, may be worth a go. Cheers. I think long term though it's Laquering.

nick, if you know any sprayers that have a good track record with fibreglass I'd be interested in a quote but probably out of budget at the moment.

[NWVT]

i know just the bodyshop il try and get a ruff quote there only just off the m27 near fareham

[Lakelord]

These guys also excellent with composite bodies.

http://www.specialisedpaintwork.com/home.htm

[ChrisC]

Fiona, if you need anything Autoglym drop round, i have a bottle of pretty much everything they do.
They also do a natural (i think its called high definietion wax) which I have, so you can test the egp which is syntetic vs that if you want.

I rekon trying a little bit with some laquer, I have two types, see if that will work.

The way I see it try everything before you comit to a full respray or somthing expensive. If it works and you can DIY it that might save you the price of a trip to the western sahara :-)

[ChrisC]

oh we can also try out various abrasives before the lacquer, i have rubbing compound, abrasive scratch remover, t-cut, and t-cut mild (for metalics).

[Harsh]

if you're talking repaint then these guys are worth looking at.......
http://www.petrolheadnirvana.com/torque/showthread.php?t=621



this is what Al did for my 360 and the cost was a lot less than you would imagine...

http://www.petrolheadnirvana.com/torque/showthread.php?t=660

failing that i would say a decent detailer would have the tools to do the job properly
Dave at Sportscar protection could be an option as is Lee (tango man) who has done my M3 in the past and made a very good job of it.

[Fiona]

Bachi, I would dearly love to have it nicely sprayed by someone who knows what they're doing with fibreglass. However I fear my budget is going to be way lower than your's. I'd still be interested in a quote so I know for the future but unless it's well under 4 figures I couldn't even consider it. I should have a bit of cash to play with early next year but I've kind of mentally spent that already :)

Toyota needs doing too, maybe he'd give me a 2fer :D

Seriously though, I think I am gonna have to go the laquer route, at least for now.

Chris, might take you up on that, maybe divide the boot lid in 3 and try the different polishs and laquer and see which lasts best.

[ChrisC]

spending money you dont have yet, are you sure you dont work in banking Fiona? ;-)

The polishes and waxs wont really last, as lakelord says, you can hope for about 6 months at most. The laquer is the only way to get a permanant finish I think.

[Fiona]

Yep, I've tried pretty much all the waxes and polishes going and, well, you saw the car on monday, it's worse than ever!

Hmmm, if I worked in banking I'd have 5 cars instead of 3 wouldn't I? ;)

[ChrisC]

hey! who told you how many cars I have!.......

[Fiona]

I was thinking of someone else who round here, didn't know you were a banker too!

[Fiona]

Someone has thrown another suggestion at me.....varnish!

I have severe doubts and pointed out that varnish goes yellow, oxidises and cracks.

He was serious though and reckons it would last a good couple of years, buying me a bit of time to save up for a respray. He reckons glaze won't stop the oxidisation coming back but that with varnish I won't even need to polish it out, the varnish will just bring it up shiney.

I have my reservations however if it worked it would be a very cheap, easy, quick fix.

So, is this crazy or does his suggestion have any merit?? Oh and varnish on fibreglass? Any chemical reactions? I've never tried varnishing fibreglass before.

[ChrisC]

is there a chanderly near your fi? try asking them, they would sell yacht varnish and should know if it reacts with the gelcoat.

[Fiona]

Yep, there's a chandlery on the marina here, when they can be bothered to open. Come to think of it I could try asking my dad, what with him having worked as a yacht builder most of his life.

[chevy-stu]

Fiona, if you're coming to the Ace on 11th Jan, let me know and I can meet you earlier at my bodywork guys who are only in Mill Hill NW7, few miles from the Ace up A41/A1 and they will give you a rough quote to clear coat it..

[Fiona]

oh, cool. Yeah I'll be there and not working on 11th so can come up earlier. A few people have said laquering won't stop it coming back but it'd be good to get another opinion. Let me know a time and postcode. Have a look in the "your first car" thread at what killer used to look like, so sad :( but then I have had him 12 years and he has been very much used and abused so not doing too badly really :D

[Redex R]

I'm quite interested in this lacquering procedure , I've seen many a red car suffer from oxidisation -Toyota MR2/Celicas and Ford XR3Is in particular also I've never found Autoglym polishes much kop on old Cellulose paintwork and always revereted to the old turtle wax from a tin - lots of elbow grease but it works and lasts for a while , lacquering certainly sounds like a good idea.

[Fiona]

The colours in the Gel coat on mine rather than painted. Was using Mer but didn't like the white "dust" it left on black bodywork. Autoglym always used to bring it up nice though. Haven't tried turtle wax, did it get rid of the oxidisation?

[chevy-stu]

Hey Fiona, might be a bit late to organise for tonight, and I'm guessing you may be in another car, but did you still want to get a quote from my bodywork guy for a clear laquer job.. ?

[Sportscar Protection Dave]

Hi Fiona ,
I don't have much experience working with Gel coat ,normally standard painted cars. but from reading through the thread I'd say the problems started when you first started using Mer and or the autoglym .
The problem is that they are abrasive polishes , so the minute you start using them they slowly wear away the surface of the gel coat ,this results in the surface braking down over the long term , which is probably why you are getting oxidisation.

I have a product made by G-technic(originally designed for yachts) http://www.gtechniq.com/
which is basically a machine polish compound designed for gel coat applications .

it works differently to standard bodyshop/detailing compounds which basically work by sanding down the paint.

The g-technic (in laymans terms) works by reactivating the surface of the gel coat and moving it around , rather than sanding it off , this brings back the natural shine of the original finish.
G-techniq also do a sealant which again is designed for yachts to help protect the regenerated finish from UV and the elements , which works extremely well in hot conditions .
We use this when we restore the carbon fibre engine bits in Ferrari 360 CS and 430 Scuderias , as the lacquer in them goes milky from the heat.
This could be an option for you ,providing too much gel coat hadn't been removed (we have all the latest paint depth gauges to work this out) the cost would be around £500 for the whole car.
I'd be happy to pop in and take a look for you , if it doesn't work out then I wouldn't charge you and you could then look at the re-lacquer option , which i think would be the next best way to go , TBH i don't know anything about the varnish option but it doesn't sound too viable as you don't want to make it worse ,
if you have any qestions, feel free to reply or give us a bell on 07970 713062
Cheers
Dave

[Fiona]

Sounds interesting. I've tried a lot of different products, including marine ones and ones claiming nano technology etc so can't help being sceptical. How often would the sealant need to be reapplied to stop the oxidisation coming back?

Where are you based? No harm in taking a look and having a chat, maybe a small test area to see how well it works? £500 is halfway to a respray so I'd need to be confident of it being a reasonably permanent solution.

Cheers,

Fiona

[Fiona]

Picked up a new product in the chandlery the other day. I was sceptical but the initial test panel is looking promising. certainly an improvement for and as I've spent the respray money on a new car at least it'll look a bit better while I save up again.

This was just a brief test before/after. I think with a second going over it should come up even better :D

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff144/flossie007/cars/PICT0640.jpg

[Fiona]

I was hoping to get out and have another go with this stuff before work. I've only done one test panel at the moment so I wanted to have another go over it to see if it came up any better and then put some Autoglym Extra gloss protection over the top. But it was rainy and drizzly all day :(
Not to be defeated I had a go at the rust spotted chrome instead. It's come up rather well :), although I did get a lot of comments about polishing the car in the rain :(
http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff144/flossie007/cars/PICT0651.jpg